Allen Ginsberg: Now, what is Kalki’s nature?
Prabhupäda: Kalki’s nature, that is described in Bhägavata. He will come just like a prince, royal dress with sword, and on horseback, simply killing, no preaching. All rascals killed. No more preaching. (laughing) That is the last. There will be no brain to understand what is God.
Allen Ginsberg: There will be no brain to understand God?
Prabhupäda: They will be so dull, so dull. It requires brain to understand. Just like in the Bhägavata it is said that evaà prasanna-manaso [SB 1.2.20], “fully joyful,” bhagavad-bhakti-yoga, “by practice of bhakti-yoga.” Evaà prasanna-manaso bhagavad-bhakti-yogataù, mukta-saìgasya: “and freed from all material contamination.” He can understand God. Do you think God is so cheap thing, anyone will understand? Because they do not understand, they present something nonsense: “God is like this. God is like that. God is like that.” And when God Himself comes, that “Here I am, Kåñëa,” they don’t accept it. They’ll create their own God.
Allen Ginsberg: So Kalki comes at the end of the Kali-yuga?
Allen Ginsberg: And is Kalki connected with the Kali-yuga cycle?
Prabhupäda: Yes. Kalki, yes.
Allen Ginsberg: So He would come at the end of Kali-yuga to end the yuga.
Prabhupäda: Yes. Then Satya-yuga will begin.
Allen Ginsberg: Then what begins?
Allen Ginsberg: Which is?
Prabhupäda: Satya-yuga, the pious. Satya-yuga. People will be pious, truthful, long-living.
Allen Ginsberg: Are those people that remain or whatever new creation comes out of the destruction?
Prabhupäda: Some of them will remain, some of them. It will not completely extinguish. Some of them will remain, pious. Pariträëäya sädhünäà vinäçäya ca duñkåtäm [Bg. 4.8]. All miscreants will be killed, and out of them, there must be some pious… They remain.
Allen Ginsberg: Do you think of this in terms of a historical event that will occur in the lifetime of your disciples?
Prabhupäda: No. This will happen at least 400,000’s of years after, at least. So by that time…
Allen Ginsberg: They will go down, down, down for 400,000 years?
Prabhupäda: Yes. So at that time my disciples will be with Kåñëa. (laughter)
Prabhupäda: And those who will not follow them, they will see the fun, how they are being killed. (laughter)
Allen Ginsberg: 400,000 years. Will people still be chanting Hare Kåñëa in 400,000…
Prabhupäda: No. Hare Kåñëa will be finished within ten thousand years. There will be no more Hare Kåñëa.
Allen Ginsberg: Ah. So what will be left?
Prabhupäda: Nothing. Left will be I’ll kill you and eat you, and you shall kill me. You shall eat me. That will be left.
Allen Ginsberg: After ten thousand years?
Prabhupäda: Yes. There will be no grain, no milk, no sugar, no fruit. So I have to eat you, and you will have to eat me. Full facility for meat-eating. (laughter) Full facility. Kåñëa is very kind. He’ll give you facility: “All right. Why cows and calves? You take your own son. Yes. Eat nicely.” Just like serpents, snakes, they eat their own offsprings, tigers. So this will happen.
Allen Ginsberg: Kali eats her own…
Prabhupäda: Yes. And there will be no brain to understand, no preacher, nothing else. Go. Go to, to the dog. And then Kåñëa will come: “All right, let me kill you so that you are saved.” So…
Allen Ginsberg: But you see it as actually a historical thing of ten thousand years for the chanting, of the diminishing chanting of…
Prabhupäda: Yes. These are…
Allen Ginsberg: Well, then do you think more people will chant Hare Kåñëa or fewer?
Prabhupäda: Oh, yes. More people. Now it will increase.
Allen Ginsberg: Until?
Prabhupäda: Up to ten thousand years.
Allen Ginsberg: And then?
Prabhupäda: Then diminish.
Allen Ginsberg: So what is the purpose of right now, a world increase…
Prabhupäda: People will take advantage of this up to ten thousand years. Then they will…
Allen Ginsberg: So this is like the last rope, the last gasp.
Prabhupäda: (laughs) Yes. So the sooner we take to shelter, shelter of Kåñëa consciousness, is better.
Allen Ginsberg: Well, then, according to Vedic theory, when did this yuga begin? According to this Vedic theory… Or… This is çästra?
Allen Ginsberg: When did this yuga…?
Prabhupäda: Begin from this Caitanya Mahäprabhu. He introduced five hundred years ago, and it will continue now.
Prabhupäda: Kali-yuga has begun five thousand years ago.
Allen Ginsberg: Began five thousand years ago.
Kértanänanda: But this wave within Kali-yuga, in which Hare Kåñëa increases and then diminishes, is about ten thousand years and that began five hundred years ago.
Prabhupäda: Kali-yuga, the duration of life of Kali-yuga is 432,000’s of years. Out of that, we have passed five thousand years. There is balance, 427,000’s of years. Out of that, ten thousand years is nothing.
Allen Ginsberg: Where is all this?
Prabhupäda: Vedic literature.
Allen Ginsberg: What…?
Prabhupäda: Padma Puräëa, Puräëas.
Allen Ginsberg: Bhägavata Puräëa.
Prabhupäda: Bhägavata Puräëa.
Allen Ginsberg: Has the detailed analysis of what goes on within the Kali-yuga?
Prabhupäda: Oh, yes. Oh, yes, yes. I’ll read you sometimes.
Allen Ginsberg: There are translations of that. There are some translations of that.
Prabhupäda: Yes. In the Twelfth Canto, the Kali-yuga descriptions are there.
Allen Ginsberg: Twelfth Canto.
Prabhupäda: Twelfth Canto. And you will find that all the descriptions are coming to be true. Just like there is one statement, svékaram eva udvahe: “Marriage will be performed simply by agreement.” Now that is being done. And lävaëyaà keça-dharaëam: “People will think that he has become very beautiful by keeping bunch of hairs.” That is coming true. These are written there. All things are there in Bhägavata history.
Allen Ginsberg: Well, in the Bhägavata Puräëa is there also provision for the Caitanya cult?
Prabhupäda: Oh, yes. Oh, yes. Kåñëa-varëaà tviñäkåñëam [SB 11.5.32]. We have given that in that book, our Teachings of Lord Caitanya. That is the first quotation there.
Allen Ginsberg: So it’s on this quotation from Bhägavata Puräëa that Caitanya built His system?
Prabhupäda: No, no. That is program, already presented, and He came to execute the program. Just like our meeting is already programmed. I come and execute it. That’s all. That was previous. Clearly it is said, ” ‘In the Kali-yuga the Supreme Lord comes as one who always chants the holy name of Çré Kåñëa, who is Çré Kåñëa Himself, whose complexion is yellow.’ Çrémad-Bhägavatam, Eleventh Canto, Fifth Chapter, 32nd verse.”
Allen Ginsberg: It’s in there.
Prabhupäda: So we have accepted Lord Caitanya as Kåñëa not fanatically. There are evidence in Mahäbhärata, in Upaniñads, in Puräëas, in Bhägavata, in all Vedic scripture.
Allen Ginsberg: Well, then, within this period of ten thousand years, only those who hear Kåñëa’s name and worship Kåñëa by chanting…
Prabhupäda: Yes. Kértanäd eva kåñëasya mukta-saìgaù paraà vrajet [SB 12.3.51]. That is also stated in the Çrémad-Bhägavatam.
Allen Ginsberg: So only those who practice Kåñëa chanting can attain mokña.
Prabhupäda: They become immediately liberated and go back to home, back to Godhead.
Allen Ginsberg: And everybody else gets involved deeper and deeper in the yuga.
Prabhupäda: Yes, yes, yes. So if anyone believes in the çästras, they should take to this Kåñëa consciousness.
Room Conversation with Allen Ginsberg – May 13, 1969, Columbus, Ohio